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	<title>Comments on: Gillmor Gang 05.09.08</title>
	<atom:link href="http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/2008/05/09/gillmor-gang-050908/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/2008/05/09/gillmor-gang-050908/</link>
	<description>Industry experts and thought leaders mix it up in The Gillmor Gang's daily conversation on what's hot in technology and social media.</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 17:19:26 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: I don&#8217;t pay attention to that anymore&#8230; &#171; Derivadow.com</title>
		<link>http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/2008/05/09/gillmor-gang-050908/#comment-534</link>
		<dc:creator>I don&#8217;t pay attention to that anymore&#8230; &#171; Derivadow.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 May 2008 21:38:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/?p=144#comment-534</guid>
		<description>[...] My problem with APML is that it&#8217;s based on a view of file transfer and data sharing - one where you copy and move a file from one system to the next. I just don&#8217;t believe that that is how the Internet works. As Chris Messina puts it (in relation to dataportability.org): In my mind, when the arena of application is the open, always-on, hyper-connected web, constructing best practices using an offline model of data is fraught with fundamental problems and distractions and is ultimately destined to fail, since the phrase is immediately obsolete, unable to capture in its essence contemporary developments in the cloud concept of computing (which consists of follow-your-nose URIs and URLs rather than discreet harddrives), and in the move towards push-based subscription models that are real-time and addressable. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] My problem with APML is that it&#8217;s based on a view of file transfer and data sharing - one where you copy and move a file from one system to the next. I just don&#8217;t believe that that is how the Internet works. As Chris Messina puts it (in relation to dataportability.org): In my mind, when the arena of application is the open, always-on, hyper-connected web, constructing best practices using an offline model of data is fraught with fundamental problems and distractions and is ultimately destined to fail, since the phrase is immediately obsolete, unable to capture in its essence contemporary developments in the cloud concept of computing (which consists of follow-your-nose URIs and URLs rather than discreet harddrives), and in the move towards push-based subscription models that are real-time and addressable. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Hamish MacEwan</title>
		<link>http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/2008/05/09/gillmor-gang-050908/#comment-402</link>
		<dc:creator>Hamish MacEwan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 May 2008 06:58:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/?p=144#comment-402</guid>
		<description>Gillmor: There’s no decentralized solution because it’s not going to have a control point, b[y] definition.

Guess I'm as puzzled as Doc as to why twitter needs a control point.  This from the man who said we each control our data.

Lee: Right now, with Twitter, I follow you that Twitter controls the point of — it takes your updates and broadcasts simply. If I lose you, then I don’t receive your updates anymore. But if we try to decentralize this, and I just kind of subscribe to you, how do I tell you that I want to receive your updates? How do I tell you that I want you to broadcast to me?

This is no problem. Replace "updates" with "email" and the answer is obvious.  Further P2P file exchange seems to happen in quite a decentralised way, to the fury of incumbent distributors.  How hard would it be to have a P2P client (locally or in the cloud) that use a bittorrent type of protocol to distribute, tweets, files, status, presence, favourites, etc. etc.

We certainly don't need MS's "mesh."  It seems too star for my taste.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gillmor: There’s no decentralized solution because it’s not going to have a control point, b[y] definition.</p>
<p>Guess I&#8217;m as puzzled as Doc as to why twitter needs a control point.  This from the man who said we each control our data.</p>
<p>Lee: Right now, with Twitter, I follow you that Twitter controls the point of — it takes your updates and broadcasts simply. If I lose you, then I don’t receive your updates anymore. But if we try to decentralize this, and I just kind of subscribe to you, how do I tell you that I want to receive your updates? How do I tell you that I want you to broadcast to me?</p>
<p>This is no problem. Replace &#8220;updates&#8221; with &#8220;email&#8221; and the answer is obvious.  Further P2P file exchange seems to happen in quite a decentralised way, to the fury of incumbent distributors.  How hard would it be to have a P2P client (locally or in the cloud) that use a bittorrent type of protocol to distribute, tweets, files, status, presence, favourites, etc. etc.</p>
<p>We certainly don&#8217;t need MS&#8217;s &#8220;mesh.&#8221;  It seems too star for my taste.</p>
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		<title>By: Weblog on steroids: Twitter als Vorbild : Georg Holzer</title>
		<link>http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/2008/05/09/gillmor-gang-050908/#comment-366</link>
		<dc:creator>Weblog on steroids: Twitter als Vorbild : Georg Holzer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 10:24:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/?p=144#comment-366</guid>
		<description>[...] Microblogging-Plattform mit ähnlichem Featureset wie Twitter. Mehr dazu gibt&#8217;s auch am Podcast der Gillmor Gang (absolut [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Microblogging-Plattform mit ähnlichem Featureset wie Twitter. Mehr dazu gibt&#8217;s auch am Podcast der Gillmor Gang (absolut [...]</p>
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		<title>By: The Blood Brain Barrier</title>
		<link>http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/2008/05/09/gillmor-gang-050908/#comment-352</link>
		<dc:creator>The Blood Brain Barrier</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 May 2008 18:56:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/?p=144#comment-352</guid>
		<description>[...] as standards-based solutions to the so-called centralization problem. Gillmor Gangs on Thursday and Friday delved into the mysteries of decentralization, but I remain unconvinced that these strategies do [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] as standards-based solutions to the so-called centralization problem. Gillmor Gangs on Thursday and Friday delved into the mysteries of decentralization, but I remain unconvinced that these strategies do [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Nationalize Twitter? Hmm, not so fast &#171; IT Spot</title>
		<link>http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/2008/05/09/gillmor-gang-050908/#comment-351</link>
		<dc:creator>Nationalize Twitter? Hmm, not so fast &#171; IT Spot</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 May 2008 17:19:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/?p=144#comment-351</guid>
		<description>[...] publicized brown-outs naturally raise questions about backup plans in case of further outages. The Gillmor Gang, in particular, has into this question, but the most searching critique I&#8217;ve come across [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] publicized brown-outs naturally raise questions about backup plans in case of further outages. The Gillmor Gang, in particular, has into this question, but the most searching critique I&#8217;ve come across [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Blaine Cook</title>
		<link>http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/2008/05/09/gillmor-gang-050908/#comment-350</link>
		<dc:creator>Blaine Cook</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 May 2008 17:19:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/?p=144#comment-350</guid>
		<description>A few points.

1. Micro-blogging can be generalized to PhotoBlogging or Blogging or MusicBlogging or whatever you want. I'll stick to discussing micro-blogging for the purpose of this discussion, but don't stop at Twitter.

2. If you have real-time feeds available from all micro-blogging sites (twitter.com, jaiku.com, pownce.com, scripting.com, myrandomasssite.com, etc) and they're push based, building track on top of that platform is limited only by the volume of messages you're able to process. I should know, I built track for Twitter. In about 12 hours last September.

3. Twitter is extremely open as far as data exchange / portability / whatever you want to call it. You can ask, and they'll give you a full, real-time feed of every single public twitter update. Q: How far is it from being able to subscribe to a given user on Twitter, through a syntax like blaine@twitter.com? A: Not very. As in, about a line of code. The problem: authentication / authorization and user interface. Period.

4. Roughly 3/4 of requests to Twitter are API requests (i.e., they don't show up in Alexa or Compete); the amount of energy expended on handling those requests, combined with the amount of energy expended on creating those requests is extremely high, and grows faster than linearly (i.e., more people on the system means more polling per user). How much power is there in data centers: not much. At some point, using asynchronous methods becomes a major competitive advantage, and companies can start profiting from carbon offset models, rather than paying for them.

Anyhow, if you think the various components in Twitter that promote open exchange of data are accidental side-effects, think again. Ralph Meijer (formerly of Jaiku) and I successfully demonstrated federated micro-blogging between Jaiku and Twitter using XMPP at the Social Graph Foo Camp back in February. Obviously I can't speak for Twitter's current interest, but when I left they were interested in the direction (think: smaller fish, bigger pond, brand and technology leader).

There are a number of people working on seeing this happen, and for more things than just micro-blogging. In my opinion, it would be unwise to ignore the ramifications of an RSS-like network that is (1) real-time and (2) addressable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A few points.</p>
<p>1. Micro-blogging can be generalized to PhotoBlogging or Blogging or MusicBlogging or whatever you want. I&#8217;ll stick to discussing micro-blogging for the purpose of this discussion, but don&#8217;t stop at Twitter.</p>
<p>2. If you have real-time feeds available from all micro-blogging sites (twitter.com, jaiku.com, pownce.com, scripting.com, myrandomasssite.com, etc) and they&#8217;re push based, building track on top of that platform is limited only by the volume of messages you&#8217;re able to process. I should know, I built track for Twitter. In about 12 hours last September.</p>
<p>3. Twitter is extremely open as far as data exchange / portability / whatever you want to call it. You can ask, and they&#8217;ll give you a full, real-time feed of every single public twitter update. Q: How far is it from being able to subscribe to a given user on Twitter, through a syntax like <a href="mailto:blaine@twitter.com">blaine@twitter.com</a>? A: Not very. As in, about a line of code. The problem: authentication / authorization and user interface. Period.</p>
<p>4. Roughly 3/4 of requests to Twitter are API requests (i.e., they don&#8217;t show up in Alexa or Compete); the amount of energy expended on handling those requests, combined with the amount of energy expended on creating those requests is extremely high, and grows faster than linearly (i.e., more people on the system means more polling per user). How much power is there in data centers: not much. At some point, using asynchronous methods becomes a major competitive advantage, and companies can start profiting from carbon offset models, rather than paying for them.</p>
<p>Anyhow, if you think the various components in Twitter that promote open exchange of data are accidental side-effects, think again. Ralph Meijer (formerly of Jaiku) and I successfully demonstrated federated micro-blogging between Jaiku and Twitter using XMPP at the Social Graph Foo Camp back in February. Obviously I can&#8217;t speak for Twitter&#8217;s current interest, but when I left they were interested in the direction (think: smaller fish, bigger pond, brand and technology leader).</p>
<p>There are a number of people working on seeing this happen, and for more things than just micro-blogging. In my opinion, it would be unwise to ignore the ramifications of an RSS-like network that is (1) real-time and (2) addressable.</p>
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		<title>By: echovar &#187; Blog Archive &#187; A Venezuelan Moment: The Gillmor Gang considers nationalizing Twitter</title>
		<link>http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/2008/05/09/gillmor-gang-050908/#comment-336</link>
		<dc:creator>echovar &#187; Blog Archive &#187; A Venezuelan Moment: The Gillmor Gang considers nationalizing Twitter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 May 2008 08:01:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/?p=144#comment-336</guid>
		<description>[...] Gillmor Gang 20080509 [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Gillmor Gang 20080509 [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Fred Grott</title>
		<link>http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/2008/05/09/gillmor-gang-050908/#comment-328</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred Grott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 May 2008 23:39:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/?p=144#comment-328</guid>
		<description>To continue a point that has been made both on FF and twtitter, I have been using FriendFeed as the filter  to twitter in that I haven to only the front page but also some search features and filters to follow the conversations I want to participate in..

But, yes it would be nice to have an easier way to follow a threaded conversation in twitter.

And last but not least the Irony of Dave Winer's decentralize statement is that when he shut off blog site switch his own service they routed around that vendor. Probably being honest about that particular aspect of his point might have made the point more solid</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To continue a point that has been made both on FF and twtitter, I have been using FriendFeed as the filter  to twitter in that I haven to only the front page but also some search features and filters to follow the conversations I want to participate in..</p>
<p>But, yes it would be nice to have an easier way to follow a threaded conversation in twitter.</p>
<p>And last but not least the Irony of Dave Winer&#8217;s decentralize statement is that when he shut off blog site switch his own service they routed around that vendor. Probably being honest about that particular aspect of his point might have made the point more solid</p>
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		<title>By: John Breslin</title>
		<link>http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/2008/05/09/gillmor-gang-050908/#comment-326</link>
		<dc:creator>John Breslin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 May 2008 21:08:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/?p=144#comment-326</guid>
		<description>We've recently written about a distributed microblogging prototype developed using semantics (client and server) - pics and more at http://url.ie/djz

The prototype uses FOAF and SIOC to model microbloggers, their properties, account and service information, and the microblog updates that users create. A multitude of publishing services can ping one or a set of aggregating servers as selected by each user, and it is important to note that users retain control of their own data through self hosting.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We&#8217;ve recently written about a distributed microblogging prototype developed using semantics (client and server) - pics and more at <a href="http://url.ie/djz" rel="nofollow">http://url.ie/djz</a></p>
<p>The prototype uses FOAF and SIOC to model microbloggers, their properties, account and service information, and the microblog updates that users create. A multitude of publishing services can ping one or a set of aggregating servers as selected by each user, and it is important to note that users retain control of their own data through self hosting.</p>
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		<title>By: Cloudlands</title>
		<link>http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/2008/05/09/gillmor-gang-050908/#comment-325</link>
		<dc:creator>Cloudlands</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 May 2008 21:03:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gillmorgang.techcrunch.com/?p=144#comment-325</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;Prototype for distributed / decentralised microblogging using semantics...&lt;/strong&gt;

Michael Arrington of TechCrunch wrote an interesting blog post on Monday about a &#8220;decentralised Twitter&#8221;, which was picked up by Dave Winer, Marc Canter and Chris Saad amongst others.
I&#8217;m happy to say that we have recently described a...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>Prototype for distributed / decentralised microblogging using semantics&#8230;</strong></p>
<p>Michael Arrington of TechCrunch wrote an interesting blog post on Monday about a &#8220;decentralised Twitter&#8221;, which was picked up by Dave Winer, Marc Canter and Chris Saad amongst others.<br />
I&#8217;m happy to say that we have recently described a&#8230;</p>
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